.
We have made a significant change in the introductory page to debunkers.org.
Come check out our new blog that is born on the 10th of May, 2004. Please read the Administrative details and rationale for the change in the homepage.
|
Debunkers
![]() Books -- Good and Bad
![]() mine wastes
|
| next newest topic | next oldest topic |
| Author | Topic: mine wastes |
|
setnahkt Member |
I have been somewhat remiss in book review duties lately, since my OCD is forcing me to get my whole library entered into LibraryThing. I have thus accumulated about thirty or so books in the “to be reviewed” stack, and you can expect a spate of more-or-less relevant reviews once I get done entering. However, since one of my recent books was read for work rather than for pleasure, I feel justified in taking some work time to review it. Hence…. My agency is in the process of buying a newspaper printing plant for conversion to a bus maintenance facility (because the existing bus maintenance facility will be converted to a commuter rail maintenance facility). A newspaper printing plant might have a few interesting environmental issues on its own; but the particular thing that interests me about the site is an earlier tenant, the Argo Smelter. I therefore thought I’d better track down some information about the environmental liabilities associated with smelters; it was surprisingly hard to do so. I finally settled on this book:
After an introduction to the history and scope of mining, Mine Wastes focuses on individual issues: sulfidic wastes, mine water, tailings, cyanidation waste, radioactive wastes, and phosphate wastes. While I had some general idea of the issues involved with all of these, the detail provided was excellent; for example, although I knew that acid mine drainage was attributable to the oxidation of pyrites, I didn’t realize that it is iron-containing pyrites that cause the greatest problem, because the conversion of iron (II) sulfide to sulfuric acid and iron (III) hydroxide is autocatalytic. I’d also been under the impression that bacterial oxidation was important; that now seems not to be the case; although iron and sulfur oxidizing bacteria like Acidothiobacillus ferroxidans and Acidothiobacillus thiooxidans are generally present in acid mine waters, they are more a result than a cause. Other interesting little tidbits were the comment that although it’s the cyanide in precious metal cyanidation that gets all the press, it’s actually the heavy metals extracted by the cyanide that are the largest environmental problem; the Rio Tinto region in Spain has been mined for more than 5000 years and the river contains over 1200 species of microorganism unique to the high acid environment, and phosphate mining is a larger producer of radioactive wastes than uranium mining. There were a couple of minor problems; author Bernd Lottermoser consistently describes the results of radon decay as “solid particles”; the book is heavily focused on the Australian mining industry; and like most Springer products, it was very expensive. And, unfortunately, I didn’t find out that much about smelter wastes; there were a couple of paragraphs noting that although runoff from smelter sites can have elevated heavy metal levels, smelter slag is generally fully oxidized and thus insoluble. [This message has been edited by setnahkt (edited 07-01-2008).] IP: Logged |
|
KGB Moderator |
quote: D*** you, Set. There goes my weekend. OCD sufferers really need to not feed off each other. Interesting. If I recall correctly, low-grade copper ore has been economically extracted by leaching -- in effect, deliberately creating acid mine drainage as a source of dissolved copper. The bacteria were supposedly a big part of making this work. I'll admit the cyanide statement surprises me. The phosphate statement does not; most of the uranium deposits in the Colorado Plateau are complex phosphates of vanadium and uranium. [This message has been edited by KGB (edited 07-01-2008).] IP: Logged |
|
llamas Member |
KGB wrote: 'Interesting. If I recall correctly, low-grade copper ore has been economically extracted by leaching -- in effect, deliberately creating acid mine drainage as a source of dissolved copper." Affirmative. In more-than-one hard-rock copper mine, the lower-grade ores and tailings are spread out in gigantic leach fields - tens or hundreds of acres - many feet deep over an impermeable membrane, then rinsed with a solution of sulphuric acid, which extracts the copper as dissolved copper sulphate. The smell must be overwhelming. And some copper mines are now being developed which work entirely on the leaching process - injection- and recovery-wells perform the same process on the ore in-situ. The copper is then extracted by electrolytic processes. llater, llamas ------------------ "All things are ready, if our minds be so." "I hope that those responsible have been sacked. And replaced by Llamas." - Glenn Harlan Reynolds IP: Logged |
|
SPQR Moderator |
Today's Denver Post had an article about proposals to begin mining uranium in Colorado with some form of in situ method involving wells. Of course, the article was really about the protesting against it. I rolled my eyes at the quotes from landowners who expressed acceptance of petroleum wells but knew that uranium mining was more dangerous to them. IP: Logged |
|
setnahkt Member |
quote: Your weekend? I've been doing it for months. I was lucky in that I had already entered a lot of books I owned into Amazon (even if I didn't purchase them there) by checking the "I own this" box on the main book page. LibraryThing allows importation of text data with ISBN numbers; the format doesn't matter, the import process just recognizes a ISBN whenever it sees one. I was thus able to cut and paste my list of owned books from Amazon. LibraryThing also sells a cheap bar-code scanner that will allow you to read in ISBNs from bar codes. Most movies nowadays have ISBNs, so I was able to enter those, too; CDs, alas, do not, so I've had to enter all those manually.
quote: Lottermoser doesn't talk that much about copper (except in his discussion of the Rio Tinto region). I assume this is because copper isn't terribly important in Australia. I should have been more specific on the bacteria; they are not that important in acid mine drainage involving pyrite or arsenopyrite or other pyrites containing iron, because chemical oxidation by iron (III) does the job. However, bacteria are still effective in oxidation of other sulfide ores.
quote: Lottermoser is pretty defensive about cyanide, commenting that it has a bad press due to its association with judicial execution and mass murder. The actual concentration of cyanide in a heap leach solution is relatively small. Cyanide ion is so reactive it will form metal complexs with just about anything; thus the "pregnant" solution from heap leaching contains not only disolved gold and silver but cadmium and arsenic and thallium and just about anything else. The gold and silver get knocked out preferentially when the solution is processed, and the solution is recycled. When you have a spill from a heap leach, the "cyanide" present is almost all as various cyanate, thiocynate and ferrocyanates, none of which are particularly toxic; the heavy metal cations associated with these are not so. (In the event you get a cyanide spill into low pH waters, things are different, since the cyanide ions will now go to hydrogen cyanide; fortunately, this is volatile enough that it will go atmospheric relatively quickly. The book provides a list of major cyanide releases from mining operations, including on in Guyana in 1995 that released 4.2M cubic meters of heap leach waste; there were no human fatalities in any of these incidents - although they were generally pretty hard on aquatic life. On the other hand, there are reports of cyanide poisoning in the Third World from cassava, and in the US and Europe from cherry or peach pits. There's a Dorothy Sayers murder mystery that (IIRC) hinges around some sort of peach liquer that while develop a cyanide-rich layer if allowed to settle. We had a bus facility next to the former site of the first cyanide leach plant in Colorado and the third in the US, operated by Horace Tabor of "Baby Doe" fame. There was no trace of cyanide in the groundwater. Lots of zinc, cadmium, lead, arsenic, copper, antimony, indium, and probably all the other metals in the periodic table if we had bothered to look for them. I've seen a picture (can't find it with Google, alas) of what was essentially a "hobbyist" heap leach process in Arizona. The owner had found silver-bearing ore on his land, set up his own relatively small heap, and was spraying cyanide solution over it with an ordinary oscillating lawn sprinkler. Although I agree the dangers from heap leaching are exaggerated, I think I'd be a little concerned about overspray if I were that guy's neighbor. I had the opportunity to visit a heap leach plant in Central City, Colorado, the Druid "Mine" (I have to put "mine" in quote here because no ore extraction was involved). Downtown Central City went from a quaint mountain town full of gimcrack souvenir shops to a mini-Las Vegas as soon as gambling was legalized. Much of the town was buried under tailings from the "Glory Hole" (including, rather to the excavator's surprise, an entire railroad station) and it was necessary to haul them off before building casinos. The operators of the Druid Mine, three grad students from the Colorado School of Mines, charged the casino developers somewhere on the order of $250/ton to dispose of their tailings waste, then heap leached it and extracted another $250/ton in gold, silver, and trace metals. While visiting the site, I noticed a cubic yard container full of beautiful blue-black crystals; "What's this?", I asked. scooping out a handful and thinking it was some sort of ore concentrate. "Sodium cycanide" replied the operator giving the tour; then she said, "You know, I think I'd wash your hands if I were you". I did so. IP: Logged |
|
KGB Moderator |
quote: I think you have more books. Including iron ions in mitochondria, hence its toxicity. I guess I should not have been surprised that the cyanide wasn't that dangerous; after all, the treatment protocol for cyanide includes administration of ferrous salts, which occur more or less naturally in most soils. IP: Logged |
|
llamas Member |
Set wrote: 'There's a Dorothy Sayers murder mystery that (IIRC) hinges around some sort of peach liquer that while develop a cyanide-rich layer if allowed to settle.' 'Bitter Almonds', a Montague Egg short story, published in the compilation 'In the Teeth of the Evidence', mid-1930s. The liqueur is something in the creme de noyuax family. The title story of this compilation also plays an interesting game with a variant of the Rouse murder, the seminal 'body in the blazing car' case from 1930. llater, llamas ------------------ "All things are ready, if our minds be so." "I hope that those responsible have been sacked. And replaced by Llamas." - Glenn Harlan Reynolds IP: Logged |
|
KGB Moderator |
Well, there went two hours of my life. LibraryThing username: kgbudge. For anyone who cares. "Only two hours?" I didn't try to put in my entire library. Anyway it looks like I have to pay to put in more than a couple hundred books. I just put in enough to get the flavor of its recommendations. Possibly a useful adjunct to the recommendations list at Amazom. IP: Logged |
|
setnahkt Member |
You have to pay to put in more than 200 books, but it's $25 for a lifetime membership. I find the recommendation engine superior to Amazon, since the Amazon engine (logically enough, I suppose) tends to put too much weight on books pruchased by Amazon and books purchased recently. In addition to the recommendation engine, you can also browse the colelctions of people who turn up on the "similar libraries" list. That's not quite as productive, since almost everybody has Tolkien and Rowling, thus you get quite a lot of overlap just to start. You do find some rather interesting books this way, though, and you can click through to Amazon and put them on a wish list or shopping cart there. IP: Logged |
All times are ET (US) | next newest topic | next oldest topic |
![]() |
|
Personal Safety
Notice: The discussions on this site may address
activities which are inherently dangerous and other
activities which could be dangerous if done improperly.
Many opinions may be expressed. All or none may be valid.
The management of this board has no way of assuring that
any of the opinions expressed are consistent with safe
practices. If you choose to follow any of the
"guidance" expressed on this site and, as a result, blow
three of your fingers off, please let us know about it so
we can laugh at your stupidity. Copyright
Restrictions: You should know the drill by now. If
you post it here, then you promise that you have the
right to do so and pledge to defend and hold harmless
this board and the staff which manages daily
operations.
The staff
reserves the right to edit or delete material you submit
if, in its judgment, your claim is not
reasonable.
Powered by Infopop www.infopop.com © 2000
Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.45c